tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post4443643190646240718..comments2024-03-28T02:27:45.688-07:00Comments on Chant du Départ: USAF Phantom PhinaleOldAFSargehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-8364067290165202032016-12-27T13:58:38.485-08:002016-12-27T13:58:38.485-08:00:):)OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-44409655354776812712016-12-27T12:08:15.581-08:002016-12-27T12:08:15.581-08:00And that was in the days when we were getting 30-5...And that was in the days when we were getting 30-50 hrs flying/mo! (Of course I'm talking Thunderbirds-like efficient to point the bird felt like an extension of one's skin.. virgil xenophonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14577165785872035948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-37999513738112049792016-12-27T07:47:11.342-08:002016-12-27T07:47:11.342-08:00Wow. Five years. I guess she was a beast!Wow. Five years. I guess she was a beast!OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-72827143664764744632016-12-26T14:00:50.405-08:002016-12-26T14:00:50.405-08:00The last of the analog fighters, the F-4 was a bea...The last of the analog fighters, the F-4 was a beast to master. Rule of thumb was that it took five years in the cockpit until one was truly comfortable and felt that one could make it do whatever one wanted it to do. (basically one's entire first tour)<br /><br />(And yes, I hated flying wing on the left)virgil xenophonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14577165785872035948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-51314492325543378042016-12-23T07:25:17.200-08:002016-12-23T07:25:17.200-08:00Two!Two!OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-26237465526854237892016-12-22T20:38:19.549-08:002016-12-22T20:38:19.549-08:00Delivering iron years ago, I always preferred bein...Delivering iron years ago, I always preferred being number two rather than three or four. Mostly because I would be on lead's right. The join-up after takeoff was always easier somehow. Even as four, I'd join up on the right, then flip under. I rarely led, being the lowest ranking AC in the squadron - but that's another story. I guess I remember that the turn out was always to the North (go figure) and we took off west-bound 99% of the time.Dave's Daily Day Dreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17491764990082380190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-5940922468745803172016-12-22T20:14:29.719-08:002016-12-22T20:14:29.719-08:00Heh, I can imagine!Heh, I can imagine!OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-35637137719884776242016-12-22T19:36:36.887-08:002016-12-22T19:36:36.887-08:00Flying on leads right always felt more comfortable...Flying on leads right always felt more comfortable to me. I always thought it was because you were kinda turned that way with your left hand on the throttles on left side of cockpit and right hand on stick in the center. But I don't know for sure.<br />Lost wingman is NEVER a fun maneuver. I have done a barrel roll into lead to maintain sight. Would have happily killed the student who put me there, but it was over in a second and we were on the other wing. Watching lead do a double take was fun tho.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-7417160778828731172016-12-22T19:31:33.598-08:002016-12-22T19:31:33.598-08:00Very first night at Kadena, just got picked up by ...Very first night at Kadena, just got picked up by The Drapire from the MAC terminal, as we passed the flight line there were (as I recall) 70+ F-4s parked out there.<br /><br />Man, they're like the buffalo, used to be thousands of 'em, now they're mostly gone.<br /><br />Sigh...OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-34710704867630587232016-12-22T17:47:42.873-08:002016-12-22T17:47:42.873-08:00Even though we knew the day would come, it doesn&#...Even though we knew the day would come, it doesn't make it any less depressing. The first time I went<br />to DM in 1972, I was shocked to see that they were already mothballing Phantoms!!rkinionhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05432551832152096206noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-68237403581311407852016-12-22T17:17:26.245-08:002016-12-22T17:17:26.245-08:00I'm used to seeing the wingman to lead's r...I'm used to seeing the wingman to lead's right, not left. But in a finger four the second element lead would be to the left wouldn't he? I didn't think the pilot with the camera was all that comfortable in that spot.<br /><br />But what do I know? I was a maintainer, I'd just fix 'em when you guys broke 'em.<br /><br />:)OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-69973028894506693312016-12-22T17:15:13.440-08:002016-12-22T17:15:13.440-08:00@Shaun, I noticed in the cockpit videos how many a...@Shaun, I noticed in the cockpit videos how many aircraft there were on the ground. Place was carpeted with them, get a bunch of civilians in the pattern and I'd bet things could get "sporty."OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-43640027677047719072016-12-22T17:14:07.108-08:002016-12-22T17:14:07.108-08:00@Juvat- yeah, I saw that too. Knew a tanker pilot ...@Juvat- yeah, I saw that too. Knew a tanker pilot at Offutt, he had wanted fighters. During training he lost sight of his lead, performed (he said) a barrel-roll to find him, which is why he got tankers, not fighters, so he claimed.OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-84557940744053185232016-12-22T17:10:50.721-08:002016-12-22T17:10:50.721-08:00I know exactly what you mean Dave.I know exactly what you mean Dave.OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-4884915689641292712016-12-22T16:47:40.805-08:002016-12-22T16:47:40.805-08:00I got really nervous watching this fellow fly wing...I got really nervous watching this fellow fly wing because he did seem to be looking inside a lot. He was certainly loose enough to do that. I wonder why he didn't tighten it up a bit. He seemed very uncomfortable with his position. If it was me, I would have been on the other side of lead. Is that just me Juvat or were you as comfortable on either position? Maybe they were demonstrating naval aviation formation flying. You never know. Formation night weather landings are the best espirit d'corps builders there are. You can't be way out there if you want to get home. Of course, they are the ones lucky enough to be flying, not me. I shouldn't complain. I couldn't do it anymore (probably).Dave's Daily Day Dreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17491764990082380190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-64089740724541105112016-12-22T16:28:59.989-08:002016-12-22T16:28:59.989-08:00Now that really makes me feel old that my airplane...Now that really makes me feel old that my airplane is nearing posterity. My wife thinks I am as well.Dave's Daily Day Dreamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17491764990082380190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-15729552649218000062016-12-22T15:55:41.654-08:002016-12-22T15:55:41.654-08:00Wittman is said to be the busiest airpatch in the ...Wittman is said to be the busiest airpatch in the world during AirVenture. Lots and lots and lots of light planes in the air. Meticulously controlled and with everyone on their best behavior, but in that environment with low clouds and haze I can imagine a military pilot wanting to keep a third eye out for traffic. I also noticed that on the dirty pass they had their hooks down, and in the cockpit vid you could see him moving the handle in conjunction with raising gear and flaps. Probably not accustomed to messing with the hook in that configuration whilst flying form.PrairieAdventurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06466447251827774900noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-48306394192037953012016-12-22T14:42:03.178-08:002016-12-22T14:42:03.178-08:00Yeah, I would glance to the left with my eyes, to ...Yeah, I would glance to the left with my eyes, to track the runway with my peripheral, but would keep him in my view, it could just be the camera he was using. There's one view of it in the mirror and it looks like a flashlight tube. It may just be the apparent motion of his head moving the camera more than is actually true. Course he didn't spend a lot of time in actual fingertip. The aft wingtip light was slightly forward of the fuselage star and the trailing edge of the slab was not aligned (you could see both edges). Which meant he was slightly wide, maybe half a wingspan or so. At that distance, one can afford to actually look at a gauge or runway or something. <br />There's one spot in the clip, about 4:20, where I think he actually lost sight of lead for a bit. That would not be cool! juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-12648619908298489212016-12-22T12:20:11.418-08:002016-12-22T12:20:11.418-08:00Thanks Shaun.
Juvat - I too thought he was moving...Thanks Shaun.<br /><br />Juvat - I too thought he was moving his head too much as well. Wouldn't you keep your eyes on lead and trust him/her not to drive you off the runway?OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-50331574133725472872016-12-22T12:18:38.107-08:002016-12-22T12:18:38.107-08:00Collings Foundation has an F-4D which they fly aro...Collings Foundation has an F-4D which they fly around the country. Hopefully someone gets an E-model in civilian hands.<br /><br />Would hate to think there are so few left flying.<br /><br />Thanks Aaron, Happy Hanukkah to you and yours. (Starts sundown on the 24th I believe?)OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-57437315306401147802016-12-22T12:11:59.271-08:002016-12-22T12:11:59.271-08:00I've seen one source that says the ratio of ma...I've seen one source that says the ratio of maintenance hours to flight hours runs from 5-1 to 10-1 for the Super Hornet. FOr the Tomcat that source says 50-1. One reason why there are no Tomcats in the fleet anymore.OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-62792910544450653552016-12-22T11:19:02.463-08:002016-12-22T11:19:02.463-08:00I enjoyed the "flight". I don't rem...I enjoyed the "flight". I don't remember my head turning forward as much when flying as #2 as this guy's did. Course that could be that I turned it just enough to get the info I needed, and nobody was recording it. juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-26405265875396804412016-12-22T11:17:16.491-08:002016-12-22T11:17:16.491-08:00The AOA in landing config wasn't all that high...The AOA in landing config wasn't all that high, provided you maintained airspeed. Maintaining altitude if you were slow though could get you behind the power curve in a hurry though. (BTW, behind the power curve is an actual aeronautical term, it basically means that there's a point in the engine envelope, where the engine won't produce enough thrust to get you out of a stall. The only way to regain flying speed is to reduce the AOA, which generally means lower the nose. No big deal....if you've got sufficient altitude. If not, you've got two options, ride it in in a stall, or ride it in in a dive. The descent rate probably precludes a successful ejection.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-67961775080357497182016-12-22T10:47:40.311-08:002016-12-22T10:47:40.311-08:00That low speed high drag high alpha pass looked a ...That low speed high drag high alpha pass looked a little bit, um, uncomfortable.<br /><br />Great post. I remember Phantoms on the flight line at Oceana. VF-171 was the RAG and up to at least 1984 there were still a few fleet fighter squadrons flying them. It was so routine and I never thought to stop and enjoy the soon-to-be-gone sights and sounds.PrairieAdventurehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06466447251827774900noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-614146595043281762016-12-22T10:31:48.060-08:002016-12-22T10:31:48.060-08:00I didn't get to Oshkosh, just a couple airshow...I didn't get to Oshkosh, just a couple airshows in Michigan this year. One day I'll have to make it there. The F4 is quite an awesome airplane indeed. I just hope they preserve a couple in flying condition for posterity.<br /><br />Merry Christmas to you, your family, and the rest of the crew and their families of Chant Du Depart.Aaronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08146728790019377401noreply@blogger.com