tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post6655776314215290884..comments2024-03-28T22:08:48.577-07:00Comments on Chant du Départ: Take your seats!OldAFSargehttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comBlogger38125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-35095852270370352232017-04-26T18:00:52.546-07:002017-04-26T18:00:52.546-07:00Legality and morality are not synonymous.Legality and morality are not synonymous.OldAFSargehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15935839956936191547noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-61207582790280220792017-04-26T14:43:38.037-07:002017-04-26T14:43:38.037-07:00"If he didn't get bloodied, we wouldn'...<i>"If he didn't get bloodied, we wouldn't be talking about this."</i><br />Exactly. <br /><i>"there's nothing in the contract of carriage about before or after boarding changing the terms. "</i> Well...there wasn't then, but is now (in United Procedures and I would be very surprised if something along those lined doesn't get written into law). It shouldn't have required changing as it was "not right" as written, and that was the point of my post. There are a lot of things that are perfectly legal that are still not right.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-20877655361090742252017-04-26T12:51:54.581-07:002017-04-26T12:51:54.581-07:00I have little respect for any adult that acts like...I have little respect for any adult that acts like a petulant child though, no matter the circumstances. Plenty of my airline buddies will disagree with the "once seated" aspect. A contract (your ticket) is only to be transported- not when or how. Just because you got seated doesn't mean squat. Sure, it's bad PR to remove someone, which is why they use bribes, but there's nothing in the contract of carriage about before or after boarding changing the terms. If he didn't get bloodied, we wouldn't be talking about this. Tunahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04930237104692982421noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-61562409616799585642017-04-26T10:21:55.291-07:002017-04-26T10:21:55.291-07:00Me? Do a post about my vacation, when have I EVER...Me? Do a post about my vacation, when have I EVER done that (not this month anyhow). :-)juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-32648710331991816142017-04-26T10:20:57.340-07:002017-04-26T10:20:57.340-07:00"Once he was seated and harming no one United...<i>"Once he was seated and harming no one United had zero legal authority to remove him."</i><br />Agreed. <br />Sometimes resistance to tyranny (for that is what this was) is required. I did read that United has changed their procedures vis a vis Employee travel priorities and handling overbooking and even full booking. Which is a step in the right direction. juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-60965122058346848682017-04-26T03:16:23.377-07:002017-04-26T03:16:23.377-07:00I disagree. Once he was seated and harming no one ...I disagree. Once he was seated and harming no one United had zero legal authority to remove him. You kind of h<br />Know this already since they resorted to bribes and only used force when bribery failed. Think. Why would they try bribery if they had the legal authority to break their contract and simply order people off the plane? This was a case of overwhelming arrogance and vincible stupidly on the part of United's employees. They thought they could get away with it. They were wrong. HMS Defianthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10024721130102173694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-12625844030559381102017-04-25T22:13:51.757-07:002017-04-25T22:13:51.757-07:00juvat:
Please disregard the above. I misread wha...juvat:<br /><br />Please disregard the above. I misread what you wrote and did my usual fool play. I liked Amtrak the times I have ridden with them. Which cruise line are you on, if I may be nosey. My wife and I did Holland America for our Alaska cruise. Please do a post on your cruise after you have recovered from your vacation. <br /><br />PaulAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-75360091490787723102017-04-25T22:01:57.225-07:002017-04-25T22:01:57.225-07:00juvat:
Vancouver to Seattle, you could have flown...juvat:<br /><br />Vancouver to Seattle, you could have flown on Alaska Airlines. In my experience, they have been a very good airline with great staff.<br /><br />Paul L. QuandtAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-81185648442865629692017-04-25T21:50:49.495-07:002017-04-25T21:50:49.495-07:00Sure, CS should be #1, for any industry. I guess ...Sure, CS should be #1, for any industry. I guess I'm fortunate that I haven't seen otherwise. I've never been bumped, always sit where I'm supposed to, I turn off my phone, etc., so I've never experienced anything but goodness, nor have I seen others treated differently. I can blame the cops too, but how about the Doc? A video today showed him calm right up to the point of the cops coming into his row, where he played like a stubborn toddler- clenching his arms to his chest, then flapping them up and down to keep them from grabbing him. He's culpable.Tunahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04930237104692982421noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-10967168393159715832017-04-25T21:49:55.049-07:002017-04-25T21:49:55.049-07:00Hey (nny) Uncle Skip:
You need to add an anonimou...Hey (nny) Uncle Skip:<br /><br />You need to add an anonimouse (anonymous) to your "reply as" list so that I can blather on your site as I do on this one.<br />Unless, of course, you don't want me polluting your site.<br />I do like your cats. What did the dog do after s/he (?) got free from the cat attack?<br /><br />Paul L. QuandtAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-13394262918706416812017-04-25T10:50:30.277-07:002017-04-25T10:50:30.277-07:00""common sense says that United's cu..."<i>"common sense says that United's customer service was exemplary in being polite and kind to everyone to the point of having to force the due to leave,"</i><br />Let's agree to disagree with that statement as my experience is different that your's. Some truly are, as you say, exemplary. Others are not.<br />And that was the point. Customer service should always be a top priority in a service industry as the airlines are.<br />I don't blame the CEO for the concussion. I do blame the cops. I blame the CEO for the culture in the company that led to the situation.<br />juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-90580473051872582692017-04-25T10:16:12.066-07:002017-04-25T10:16:12.066-07:00I'm going to play devil's advocate here, a...I'm going to play devil's advocate here, and not just because I have been a former Premier 1K guy on United, but first- a few caveats. 1. It's horrible that a guy got bloodied. 2. United is responsible 3. I have no evidence that United researched and released the guy's criminal background. However, everybody is making this out to be as if the United CEO got on the plane and starting pummeling the guys face. I expect they tried, calmly, vainly, desperately, to get the guy to leave. While I expect the crew was under pressure to seat the crew, they were surely behind schedule and that can be not only costly, but causal factor for further delays across the network. Even so, they don't say "get off" and then immediately bring in the goon squad. At some point, if a guy is absolutely refusing to leave, repeating requests and pleadings not withstanding, he must be physically removed. We can armchair quarterback this until the next scandal, but from what I read, 3 others took the $800, one of which was the guys wife. The tragedy is that in the act of pulling him out of his seat, he was pulling away from the rent-a-cops (Cops, guards, private security, no matter- all legal authority) the dude fell and bashed his head. United's fault? Sure, but the dude is also culpable. We have no proof, but common sense says that United's customer service was exemplary in being polite and kind to everyone to the point of having to force the due to leave, which he refused to do. I get tired of so many people these days, backed by edited video, thinking that being offended, confronting authority, playing the victim, being aggrieved and outraged by Cops, Corporations, TSA, restaurant hostesses, teachers, etc., help reinforce a sense of entitlement that we don't actually have. Sure, United is going to pay, but screw that guy- no sympathy for him whatsoever.Tunahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04930237104692982421noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-28047368899686669682017-04-25T06:40:19.917-07:002017-04-25T06:40:19.917-07:00As alluded to above, we've already booked a fl...As alluded to above, we've already booked a flight on United. We're taking a cruise in Alaska. Getting off at Vancouver and Amtraking down to Seattle for the flight home (saving $, it think). Haven't ridden on a US train since I was probably 10, but rode one on our Scotland trip and enjoyed it. So...depending how this one goes, this may be our future preferred mode.<br />I also spent a bit of time on KAL and JAL, they made it as enjoyable as possible for a very long flight.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-15477485377675109892017-04-25T06:36:36.040-07:002017-04-25T06:36:36.040-07:00I don't think I've heard about that one. ...I don't think I've heard about that one. Managerial Stupidity as the cause?juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-45937865115671916602017-04-25T06:35:37.825-07:002017-04-25T06:35:37.825-07:00You and I may have met. San Antonio is my preferr...You and I may have met. San Antonio is my preferred airport, or it was until they started this latest round of construction.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-5559668188380282402017-04-24T23:59:16.478-07:002017-04-24T23:59:16.478-07:00I worked as a security checkpoint screener (pre-TS...I worked as a security checkpoint screener (pre-TSA) at KSAT.<br /><br />And We had our fair share of airline employees, even aircrew, do their damndest to put us in a foul mood as well. One Captain of a United flight refused to cooperate with screening proceedures and stormed off before he could be fully screened. My supervisor had me follow him to the gate and then I got his information as to his identity and the flight number from the gate attendant. The airport banned him from flying in or out of KSAT and United had to change his route. Permanently. <br /><br />Another idiot passenger on a Mexicana flight had a case with a paintball gin in it, including the CO² cartridge. We were refusing him to pass with it but a Mexicana airline representative overrode us and allowed him to board with it. CG-23 Sailorhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04344430385225473137noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-87762718102250212472017-04-24T23:00:44.587-07:002017-04-24T23:00:44.587-07:00Leaving o darkthirty tomorrow morning via AMTRAK f...Leaving o darkthirty tomorrow morning via AMTRAK for the coast. I really prefer traveling on AMTRAK to flying these days. How's that for a rude jostle to antiquated notions of customer service and good value for the money? I pretty much hate flying these days and got much too used to commuting across the Pacific in my last job where it was still OK to fly KAL, JAL, Asiana or way way better, more reliable, friendlier airlines than the crap we have here, if the price was within the limits set by the JTR.HMS Defianthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10024721130102173694noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-32478704502409501922017-04-24T19:55:31.930-07:002017-04-24T19:55:31.930-07:00And Delta is STILL trying to un...F their latest s...And Delta is STILL trying to un...F their latest scheduling debacle... Had to refund something approaching 2200 tickets, or so I've heard.Old NFOhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16404197287935017147noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-42492898837815075612017-04-24T18:47:01.986-07:002017-04-24T18:47:01.986-07:00I'm in agreement, Paul.I'm in agreement, Paul.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-55258387303757289182017-04-24T18:45:56.601-07:002017-04-24T18:45:56.601-07:00Yeah the bag thing is a PMO. Air Canada boards by...Yeah the bag thing is a PMO. Air Canada boards by groups (but are a United partner).coming back from London we boarded the cheap section first. Frustrating to see people stuff their bags in the overheads and then proceed to the back of the bus. So when the folks at the front boarded they went to the back to store their bags. Big CF on arrival. Hate airline travel,with a passion.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-64332502229764115162017-04-24T18:32:55.793-07:002017-04-24T18:32:55.793-07:00Evidently.Evidently.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-73746484594943631452017-04-24T15:03:58.239-07:002017-04-24T15:03:58.239-07:00Other than overseas travel, I'm traveling by r...Other than overseas travel, I'm traveling by road or rail or Alaska Airlines. And I'm not planning any overseas travel.<br /><br />Paul L. QuandtAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-69460754408136422542017-04-24T15:02:16.172-07:002017-04-24T15:02:16.172-07:00Respect their customers? The flight crews put thei...Respect their customers? The flight crews put their carry on bags in the overhead bins before the passengers get on. Like twelve feet of overhead bins. Seen it many times. One reason I only fly when I don't have the time to drive.<br /><br />Strange how there is room in the caro pits for all those bags checked at the end of the jetway but no room for the flight crew bags. Nah, I don't mind standing in the jetway while the ground crews deal with the traffic jam. So what if the jetways have no HVAC? Makes you appreciate the interior of the plane when you finally get inside.Well Seasoned Foolhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16670165728759453075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-10261892754655808942017-04-24T14:49:18.151-07:002017-04-24T14:49:18.151-07:00Wait--wait: TSA makes people chickens??Wait--wait: TSA makes people chickens??Captain Stevehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17297301009511642108noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7684531976778247960.post-2299123493129708592017-04-24T11:29:27.646-07:002017-04-24T11:29:27.646-07:00Yeah, I got the TSA proctological exam on the way ...Yeah, I got the TSA proctological exam on the way home from London. Best to just grin and bear it. I think the Brit version of TSA was at least a bit more civil about it though.juvathttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09096708575138552532noreply@blogger.com