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Praetorium Honoris

Thursday, November 7, 2019

Mos Eisley-Airport

Last night I received a Top Secret Communique from El Jefe. It went like this:

"juvat, are you ever going to be posting pictures of airplanes taken at Udvar Hazy?  The natives, led by Beans, of course, are starting to circle Chant HQ and they're carrying pitchforks and torches! I 'm sending you the video I took of it. I wonder what Beans did to his arm."
 
Shortly thereafter, my phone dinged and this video downloaded.




I responded (in Spanish because it confuses the Imperial Storm Troopers):

"Por supuesto, mi extremadamente viejo sargento de la Fuerza Aérea. Inmediatamente."
 
So, marching orders in hand, I present the Air Order of Battle for the Mos Eisley air forces.


We arrived at the museum a few minutes before it opened, but were able to go to the mezzanine and scope things out.  One commenter had spoken about the first things you see as you walk in the door.

The above would be that shot.  An SR-71 with the Space Shuttle in the background.  Unfortunately, the cell phone camera, doesn't do it justice.


Later, when we were down on the floor, I noticed something familiar on the nose gear.  This airplane had set a record when it was delivered to the museum.  It had flown from Los Angeles to Dulles in 1 hour and 4 minutes.  Heck it took me longer than that to transit the Y at Oak Hill in Austin.  In any case, Ed Yeilding had been in my Squadron at Moody (might have been Holloman).

One of the differences between Udvar Hazy and the DC museum is the airplanes are much closer to you, or maybe that's because we were virtually alone in the museum early on.

But, standing on the mezzanine, two of my favorite WWII fighters were up close and personal.




I actually had to step back a bit to get each in the shot.

The museum now opened and we headed down the ramp to the main floor.


One of my favorite Century Series Jets, the Thud.  The other is the F-104.  Both fast and sleek looking and can't turn worth a damn!
Double Hiss and Boo!  Mig-21 against which I'm 1-1-1 (First engagement I started turning with him,  He ate my lunch.  Second engagement, I was able to extend out of the fight successfully, third engagement I took a high angle gunshot with four frames on his aircraft and then managed to escape.  All at Red Flag in an F-4E.)  In the foreground is an SA-2.  Not an especially good missile, but it did tend to force you to lower altitudes where AAA (HISS!) was more effective.
 The Hun.  This is what I mean about getting up close and personal.  I couldn't get far enough away to get the entire aircraft.  The wing at the top is from a Sikorsky flying boat that is being restored.
A Navy Phantom
A RF-8 Crusader

When you're dropping nuclear depth charges, it might be useful to have an unmanned drone do it.


Highway to the "Danger Zone"  (you know you've got that running through your head now, doncha?)


A sight I'm immensely grateful never to have seen.


Then we're going into the WWII section.  An ME-163 Komet, rocket powered interceptor.  300 built. shotdown between 9 and 18 Aircraft with 10 losses.  Fast though.



Dornier DO 335 Pfeil (Arrow), a German Interceptor that didn't make it into production during the war.  The only one in existence.  Again, I couldn't get far enough away.


 A Japanese Night fighter J1N1-S "Irving".  the protrusions on the nose are radar antenna.  The weapons were upward firing from the gunner position behind the pilot.  The Irving would use the radar to position itself directly under the target, then shoot into him.  Seems to me that when things, like airplanes, or pieces thereof, stop flying, they come down.

But...what do I know?


Aichi M6A1 Seiran. A submarine carried float plane.  Given the long distance from Japan to the United States, the plane was designed to be carried within range and then launched to carry out it's attack.  Never saw combat.  Desperate times call for desperate measures.


This was our way of solving the distance issue with Japan.  Also, the payload of this particular aircraft was slightly larger than could be carried by the Seiran.  Just sayin'.


B-26 Flak Bait being restored.  According to the museum's literature, this particular aircraft flew more combat missions (202) than any other Allied aircraft.


Heinkel HE 219 Uhu.  Armed with 8 cannons and radar guided.  It was the first aircraft to become operational and have ejection seats.


Kawanishi N1K3 "George" fighter.  Later in the war, significant improvement to the Zero.


P-38 recovered and restored after a forced landing on a glacier in Greenland


Flight jackets with personal talismans.  This one must have worked.


F-6F Hellcat.  I've given up on trying to get far enough away.


WWI Spad XVI


Nieuport flown by the "Hat in the Ring" 94th Aero Squadron on initial arrival in Europe.  Squadron now flies the F-22.  This aircraft was TINY.  I'm pretty sure that cockpit would be chest high on me.  Brave men flew these aircraft.


That put us all the way around the museum and it was starting to get crowded.  So,  we decided to make our exit.

As we did.....


That was the line waiting to get in.  The Mos Eisleyians outnumbered the good guys, so we beat a hasty retreat in search of replenishment and adult recreational beverages.

Two more Mos Eisley posts to go.



64 comments:

  1. Veeerry nice juvat, an excellent first installment. Flak Bait was well-named, 202 sorties?!? As Mr. Sulu said, "Oh My!"

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    1. Yeah, that's pushing your luck a bit too often. According to this source it had been hit 1000 times, returned on one engine twice, lost electrics once and hydraulics twice (both of the latter make the aircraft extremely difficult to fly), yet still returned.

      I'd rather be lucky than good...

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  2. I'd never heard of the Heinkel He 219 and dug a little deeper.

    https://airandspace.si.edu/node/34131

    You can look at 15 photos including some taken during the restoration, and one photo shows the cockpit.
    Be sure to click on the "Long Description" button to get more information.

    And there's a Wiki.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heinkel_He_219

    I looked at your photo of the waiting line and thought, "Nope." (My actual thought was along the lines of, "De line Boss, De Line!")

    Thank you for the guided tour.


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    1. There were several, ok many, aircraft there I'd never heard of. Even more that I had, but never seen.

      De Line? Yeah, I'm glad we went early, that line might have deterred me. Would have really annoyed me if by the time I got to the front, and realized that line was for folks carrying bags and things that needed to be searched. The "no bags" line was much, much shorter.

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  3. Dad had an old paperback that I just about read the cover off of. "Untold Stories of WW2". The Wolfman of Arundel Island, The Female Nazi test pilot that flew a V1... And a story about a Japanese sub that launched an aircraft and bombed a forest in Oregon. The only bombing raid carried out against CONUS in WW2. So the M6A1 didn't make it here, but another type did.

    I get really misty looking at those beauties. That P40 was / is a classic shape. WOW....

    extra credit: What was a P-400?

    PPS: That book was by Phil Hirsch. Just found a copy, and bought it... WOHOOOO!!!

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    1. Oooh, Oooh...I know that one...It was the Export version of the P-40. Armed with a 20MM cannon in the nose and .303 guns in the wings. Flown by the Russians and, I believe, the Flying Tigers. Underpowered and underarmed is not a good way to go to combat.

      As I was thumbing through the post this morning to make sure everything posted (never a sure thing), I noticed an ironic juxtaposition of Aircraft that I hadn't seen before. In the background of the picture of the M6A1, the Japanese aircraft that was intended to attack the US Mainland, is the tail of the Enola Gay, the US aircraft that...well...you know...delivered a very effective message about our intentions. Interesting.

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    2. I noticed the tail too. I'm pretty sure a P400 is a P40 with a Zero on it's tail!!! Yuk yuk yuk....

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    3. (Don McCollor)...yes the P400 had that nickname. Apparently it couldn't outrun, outclimb, outdive, or outmaneuver a Zero...its virtue was that it could take a whole lot of punishment. [p.s. I have a hardcover version of "Untold Stories" - going to have to dig it out again and read about the "Wolfman"].

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    4. For some reason, the Russians seemed to like them, so I guess they contributed to the eventual victory.

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    5. Interestingly enough some p-400 ended up on guadalcanal as part of cactus air force , hard combat

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    6. Yep, you're right. I knew they were used somewhere in the southwest Pacific, but couldn't find where on short notice. Thanks, Pawel.

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    7. Also soviets so much liked well armored airacobras (their top ace, Pokryshkin flew one) probably because they flew mostly low and over frontline inviting hefty flak. They liked them so much in fact they ordered a follow up design p-63 with mustang style laminar flow wing. 37 mm axial cannon fit soviet spirit so much they later fitted same caliber on mig-15 and 17, much to chagrin of many US pilots over Korea and Nam.

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    8. The US idea has always been bullet density whereas the Soviets liked the idea of even one hit is a kill. I know there were days when I put a lot of lead out the front of the jet and had no hits. So, I'm not sure which theory had more validity.

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  4. I'm in and out of IAD a couple of times a year (family) and haven't yet tired of visits to Udvar Hazy. The opening vista with the SR-71 and OV-103 Discovery never fails to please! Thanks for the post.

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    1. That really is an awesome first impression. Thanks.

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  5. Nice post, juvat. Always liked the Air and Space museums. And the Air Force museum. And the .... you get the picture ...

    On another front, a guy at the range was wearing a t-shirt with the outline of an F-15 on it - turn she out he was an E model pilot from Seymour Johnson (please refrain from puerile jokes - Jay Leno already covered that a while back). Nice guy, but seemed awfully young - why is that? Drop me an email and I'll send you a pic of his shirt.

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    1. Thanks, Tom. Went to a funeral yesterday for my former boss's FIL. Lot's of my former students were in attendance. In my minds eye, they are "young". However, several of them had school age children in tow. The interface between time and memory is interesting to say the least. However, as the circumstances of the event indicated, time never reverses.

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  6. Am absolutely thrilled they've got the Uhu put together. Every time I went before (including January of this year) she was still unassembled. Now if they'd just finish Flak Bait, she's about where she was last January.

    I need to write a longer post on the Uhu, amazing aircraft. Night fighters in general were pretty slick.

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    1. Well,she's not completely together. The picture doesn't show that there's nothing forward of the cockpit. Still, she's in pretty good shape. Just one more (unnecessary) reason to revisit.

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  7. Hey Juvat;

    Good pics. I and my son went to Udvar Hazy 7 or 8 years ago and it was a .50 cent shuttle ride from Dulles. I thought the McDonalds inside the museum was pretty neat as was the gift shop. I want to go back because they have added planes since I was last there and it was neat seeing the Concorde and the "dash 80" there.

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    1. They had a "map" of displays avaiiable and I took a picture of it, and when I took a look at it to identify an airplane I didn't remember, that one wasn't on the map. I then realized the map was only about 80% correct. Which was a bit frustrating, until I came to the realization, that the primary function of the building is restoration and display is a secondary consideration.
      .

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  8. Juvat/

    FYI IIRC the book entitled "FLAK BAIT" itself points out that although Flak Bait got all the PR & fanfare because it really was shot up so much and did indeed hold the record at the time the aircrew finished their tour, a later AC and crew, "Mild & Bitter" actually came to quietly surpass the record of Flak Bait.

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    1. PS: The original hard-cover was full of great original pics.

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    2. Well....That certainly changes things. Thanks VX. Charge your next bottle of Barbancourt to Sarge's account.

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    3. Amazon has the book. The price ranges from $50 to $100. I wonder if Sarge has enough in his account for both the Rum AND the book. ;-)

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    4. Now wait just a minute...

      Ah, put it on Tuna's tab.

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    5. HA! How times change. I first read the hardcover when in fifth or sixth grade out of our old city Carnegie Public Library on 6th st just off the town square. In the summers I'd ride my bike up from my house about a mile south to my grandparents home off the square on Van Burren St and then walk some four blocks to the library to check out my summer reading and take it back to my grandparents where I would sit in a rocking chair on the big wrap-around front porch to read. (If you google "historic homes in charleston ill you'll see a pic of white restored ginger-bread--tho they've eliminated part of the porch and assoc roof to right of entrance steps where I used to sit). Sadly, I returned in the 70s to find the library had sold off most of its by-now-almost-priceless WWII holdings to make room for more "contemporary" and "relatable" subject matter as one librarian cheerfully explained. (File under: "Pearls before Swine" grrr... )

      BTW, if you want to view geological history displayed, Charleston is a prime example. Drive north out of town from the square and a few blocks later the entire country-side is flat as a pancake where the mile-high glaciers stopped scheering the land--all now prime crop-land w. hardly a tree in sight for miles around. By contrast just blocks off the town square southward before one even leaves the city limits the heavily-wooded hills and valleys of southern Illinois which escaped the glaciers begin. Charleston is right on the knife-edge of these two different geological outcomes.

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    6. VX, sounds like you and I had similar upbringing. The Library at Webb was a frequent haunt for me and I knew exactly where the WWII section was.

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  9. This was a great post, even had an unusual pict of a CG HH-52A! I was hoisted twice during wet drills over the years and spent a lot of time looking down while running the hoist.
    I have to get to the DC area! I'll be in Florida this winter... being retired I can make reservations at the Andrews Famcamp 4 months in advance.. I'll bet May would be a good time for a visit.

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    1. Don't get me wrong. If I were sitting in a little dinghy with my parachute wrapped around me and saw that sight, it would be a very long time before that crew ever had to buy drinks again. I'm just glad I never had the opportunity and glad there were guys like you around.

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    2. AMEN, brother juvat. Same for Purple Hearts--thanks but no thanks. This little Indian will pass on the heroism bit unless given no other choice. Why do you think I joined the AF? :) Now, OTOH if it involves killing lotsa baduns w.o. chance of getting nicked, why, thats a horse a different color. LEXISM: "You ain't tryin' if you ain't cheatin' " :)

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    3. Ed Rasimus taught me that Exact truism.

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  10. Righteous job, Juvat.
    ~ Skip

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  11. Regarding “Irving” and the up-guns:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schräge_Musik

    The Germans found that it worked pretty well, especially vs bombers with weak or non-existent ventral armament. So well, in fact, that our pal Uhu was also designed for it. Bits did fall off and present a serious danger, but when that happened the other guy was already in serious hurt. (It mentions dodging a one-winged Lancaster...)

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    1. Interesting, Thanks a bear.

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    2. (Don McCollor)….if I remember right the translation was "slanting music". The Uha could maneuver into the "blind spot" below the tail gunner and fire upward into the belly of the bomber. Not that gunners in night bombers were that alert. Another book "Night Fighter" tells of a British night fighter on exercises when they would fly directly behind a Lancaster at point blank range for long minutes...the tail gunner would only see them when they flashed lights to simulate firing...

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    3. Below another aircraft visibility is always problematic. And...if the first indication of a bad guys proximity is ordinance impacting your aircraft....well...I hope your life insurance premiums are current.

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  12. Good post, nice photos, neat place.

    The -163 suffered under the 'Good Idea, Bad Execution.' Point Defense Fighters need to actually be able to make it to the Defensive Area before blowing up or melting their crew. But, man, what a ride when things worked out correctly. I wonder how many times the -163 unofficially broke the sound barrier on the way up.

    Would be nice to go into the museum after hours to basically have the place all to one's self.

    As to the rabble you say I was in, nope. I ran a good shield wall. That unorganized mess offends my sensibilities. That huge blob will get all bunched up and be an easy target for one spearman or hot oil/tar/sand and water/lead/other stuff... Now, facing that? Yeah, I'd tear into that like a pro linebacker against an angry soccer team.

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    1. Thanks, Beans. Not blowing up is always a good thing, in pretty much any aspect of Human existance.

      No crowd is nice, but having a docent around to ask questions is nice. I found that one docent particularly helpful. Not only did he advise us when to get out of Dodge, we had a long talk about the Enola Gay. I'd asked him about the dome on the belly, He confirmed that it was radar and mentioned that the SilverPlate (Nuke) B-29's had removed all of the defensive gun systems except the tail gun to make up for the heavier bomb load. This was also done on the rest of the Marianas Fleet, but only after they revised tactics to attack at night. That was one of those "no Idea" moments.

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  13. So, Juvat, was it something I said or did you just decide to help Chris out with a midweek post? ;-).

    Regardless, this was a most excellent post! My days are always vastly improved with pics of aircraft!!! You did a good thing
    helping El Jefe out until his prodigal Muse decides to return home.

    I've been to the AF museum at Wright-Pat and loved it but I had never even heard of Udvar Hazy until Chris mentioned it
    one of his earlier chronicles. It sounds like someplace in Europe. It is now on my bucket list along with a visit to DC. It may never happen because My Missus's health is not the best. Due to her diabetes, the neuropathy in her legs is really bad. But thanks for a great post!!!

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    1. There is quite a bit of walking involved Russ, but they do make accomodations for mobility issues. We'll add you and her to our list.

      As to Sarge? Well, the topic was getting a bit stale, so I thought I'd cut him some slack. Besides, evidently, VX gets some rum and I get a book. I'm going to hold my breath until it arrives.


      Or not....

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    2. Was their North American F-107 parked outside the front entrance on display when you were there?

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    3. Naw, IIRC it’s inside now. Not sure I’d want to fly that one. Real sure I wouldn’t want to eject from it.

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    4. Juvat/

      Funny, my 1st cousin, Lt. Gen Carlos M Talbott (who won the Bendix xcountry air race in 1955 in an F-100C) opined to me once that between the Thud and the 107 (they were in a competition flyoff pre-production) he thought the 107 "was the better plane." (He had test flown both) Perhaps it was is allegiance to N. American speaking, I never had a chance to pick his brain on the subj--mores the pity..

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    5. I think you mentioned that before, VX. It certainly was a more interesting looking airplane, and North American Rockwell always made good looking ones.

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  14. Great pics! Nice to see that they have the wings on the Uhu and Flak Bait is slowly coming together. I'm really excited for when they finally get started on the Horton 229 that's in the restoration area too.

    (I spent way too much time playing Secret Weapons of the Luftwaffe back in the early '90s. Weird German WW2 aircraft are a bit of a guilty pleasure.)

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    1. It is a very cool place.. i think I’d do it as a 1 2 punch. Downtown first then U- V. All the finished stuff is downtown. All the unfinished (and a lot of finished stuff) is at Dulles.

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  15. I stopped at Wright-Pat on the way home from the NRA meetings in April. I took 700 pics! Thank G-d for digital!

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    1. Cell phone cameras have a lot of capabilities. Not the least of which is availability.

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  16. Went to my second visit to the USAF Museum last spring. First was in 1969 as my TSgt dad PCS'd from Kansas to then Camp Drum with a RBS unit. Wow. Favorite exhibit, by far, especially since they have the only one in existence, was the XB-70. Even my wife, jaded from my lifelong obsession with these things, was impressed. "What the hell IS that ?" Getting to M-E is on my bucket list, even if it means I have to grace that evil hive of a city with my presence to do it.

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    1. I didn’t realize it was that old. Four buildings now and outside. Mrs J and I spent 3 days there and still ran out of time. With one not so minor gripe, which I’ll readdress Monday, it’s a fabulous museum.

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  17. Regarding that Coastie helo pic- I agree, you never want to see a rescue basket, unless you need to see the rescue basket. Then again, did you AF types even fly over water? I remember seeing the Wolfpack in Kunsan always break over land, even if the runway shifted 180.

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    1. UHHH...Kadena? Okinawa...Island aka small bit of land surrounded by Pacific Ocean. Deployed Moody to Taegu. Ferried F-4 Germany to Moody. Moody, Most of our Air to Air ranges were over water. Yes, a rescue basket was a definite possibility.

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    2. Speaking of air-sea rescue when stationed in the UK we always flew in our normal flt-suits/jackets even in winter over the north sea/Baltic. The Brits thought we were SUPER cray-cray. They ALWAYS flew in their rubberized poopy-suits. They were probably right, hypothermia in winter in the drink in the North Sea is no joke, but euuuew those black (wha-no hi viz orange?) poopy-suits those Lightning jocks wore looked uncomfortable as hell.

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    3. PS: Same with flt helmets. Ever see the inside of a British one? Looks like the padding of an NFL helmet compared to the (relative) skimpy USAF shell helmet.

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    4. We were supposed to wear the poopy suits at Kunsan, with the Yellow Sea right there and I did for a while, but, IIRC the difference between not having it on and having it on didn't make enough difference to get into the dinghy. Even then, wind chill would do you in. So I decided not to. Also, the improved mobility inside the cockpit would hopefully reduce the risk of needing the suit.

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    5. All through Pilot Training, we had the old style helmets with the foam pads. Never could get it so it didn't create a hot spot. Hated the things. One of the percs of getting a fighter out of UPT was the AF had just decided to make the form fitted ones standard. You could buy one before, but they were pretty pricey. Most of the UPT IP's had bought their own and I had decided I would if sent back as a FAIP. However, first thing they did at Holloman was make the mold, and before we started flying the new helmets were in place. Felt like heaven.

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